I found the verse that was read last night. I read just about all of 1 Timothy today so that I would understand what was going on at that time. And I found the other verses that have me wondering.
Here's the exact passage:
I Timothy 2:9-15. "I want women to dress modestly, with decency and propriety, not with braided hair or gold or pearls or expensive clothes, but with good deeds, appropriate for women who profess to worship God. 11- A woman should learn in quietness and full submission. I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man; she must be silent. For Adam was formed first, then Eve. 14-And Adam was not the one deceived; it was the woman who was deceived and became a sinner. 15-But women will be saved through childbearing-if they continue in faith, love, and holiness with propriety.
I was talking to my mom about that verse today too. So is Paul saying that women will be saved if they have children??? That is sure what it sounds like. While Eve was the one deceived, Adam was clearly the disobedient one. The rest of that passage, I can accept and it's not something completely new to my ears. I know that women are only allowed to teach other women and children. When I was like a new believer, six years ago, it bothered me at first, but because of the way I've always lived. I was always challenged to do the same things that guys can do to prove something. I was always told that I could be anything I wanted to be, not to allow others to put me in a career like a secretary or nurse just because I was a female. They teach that in our high school and college. And I grabbed that philosophy and I loved the challenge. When I was working at the wastewater plant, I went through a training period throughout the plant where I worked in the laboratory, maintenance, and operations. After a period of time went by and we were evaluated to be placed in our desired areas, I was asked what I liked the most and where I would like to work. I chose maintenance. I really liked tearing apart and repairing pumps, climbing lift stations, etc. But the maintenance foreman told the superintendant that my "superior skills in the lab should be utilized instead". I was crushed. He said I didn't know enough of the tools used. But in hindsight, he was a Christian man who probably knew and believed this passage. I ended up really glad to be in the lab after we had a huge sludge spill and maintenance had to fix and clean that up!
I digress...I am a new creature in Christ so those old views are gone. I don't braid my hair, but I do braid Katia's from time to time. And I do wear a wedding ring and occassionally a necklace. I would be very much interested in reading a commentary on this section, thank you Auntie Chris. There was a time in our own church I guess, even when I was young, that women wore dresses to church and men usually wore suits. It's much more relaxed now, some people wear jeans, young men wear long shorts and sandals in the summer, and (gasp), women wear dress pants! My aunt Bonnie was telling me that when she started going to her southern baptist church in Missouri, that other women shunned her for wearing pant suits. Holy legalism! What people wear doesn't mean they aren't saved or worthy to be. I'm glad in that way, that things have changed a bit. And then on the flip side of the coin, there is something to be said for dressing up for worshipping our King. We should be presentable, modest, and honoring in what we wear to church after all we are in His house.
So I'm glad I had the time to learn a little more about Paul. I wonder what next week's study will be like.
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3 comments:
I know you're sharing and not necessarily asking for advice but I'm going to throw mine out there anyway...having been there/done that (this issue was a primary one in the cycle of abuse I just left and we attended a church for a time that drank this koolaid)...I say drop the whole study. It's scripture manipulated to keep women invisible and in "service" only roles (with their cooperation at the helm no less!) and the trail ends with women who don't know grace or individuality in Christ. It's a very, very slippery slope.
Here thousands of years after it was written, it's really not necessary for us to pick it to pieces to try to understand every nuance. We could spend our ENTIRE lives working on just one mandate in scripture, "Love one another" (or love your neighbor as yourself, or choose the variation, but you get the idea). THAT leads to more love, more grace, more life.
I know "studies" encourage us to tease apart scripture in the well-intentioned motivation of "being more like Christ". But think about that...Christ spent time praying and loving others. When do that, the rest takes care of itself.
Gina I'm sending you the commentary from my Life Application Bible pertaining to this passage....I think it might clarify things for you some.
Thanks Tia for your take on it. I'm not sure what to do. The author of the book is the same Martha Peace that wrote the Excellent Wife book and I went through that study and liked it by the end. I say at the end because at first it made me so mad. It's hard to change the way we feel or think. But I think this particular study is actually geared in the right direction, I'm just overanalyzing it. In our church, we have a generation gap. The older ladies have sort of retired, leaving everything up to the younger ones. When asked to help out with something, they respond with, "oh I've done that before." The problem is though, the ones that could use this study aren't there! But then again, there are always women younger than us that we need to set an example for. Whether it's with how to raise toddlers, or how to do canning, kids going away to college, or making bread. Or how to love our husbands when we really want to clobber them with a frying pan!:-) The actual study is on Titus 2:3-5, not Timothy. I was just stuck there with a verse we referenced in the study. Ironically, I have a hair appt. this Wednesday at the same time as the study. I had made the appt three months ago and the study wasn't even in the works. It's kind of weird though.
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